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Travel Forum / Destinations / Asia / July 2008Palace on wheels
I am looking for any input on the Palace on wheels in India. If anyone has been on it, would you please let us all now. I would imagine Dec is a good time to go on it ...correct ? We have 2 sons- 16 and 13. I am wondering if it will be fine for boys of this age ? Since we are from the US, we would like to do a trip which is organized as opposed to experimenting by ourselves. Any coach tour or other organized tour will work fine for us. We have already been to India 4 years ago and saw Delhi and the Taj etc. So this time we want to do something different. Any ideas / suggestions ? Best, Anna > I am looking for any input on the Palace on wheels in India. > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Anna It's like traveling in a bubble, completely isolated from the local population. You just see the sights. No interaction with the locals, no eating of the food, no listening to the sound, no smelling of the environment. And it's expensive as hell. But, if that's the way you want to travel, more power to you. >> I am looking for any input on the Palace on wheels in India. >> [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > >But, if that's the way you want to travel, more power to you. Far better off hiring a car and driver. Cheaper, more flexible, able to see more, and he won't leave without you if you're late getting back from sight-seeing. You also won't repeat your visit to Agra. Cheers, Alan, Australia -- http://www.flickr.com/photos/alan_s/ http://loraltravel.blogspot.com Latest: On Indian Roads > On Sat, 5 Jul 2008 21:39:59 -0700 (PDT), PeterL > [quoted text clipped - 37 lines] > --http://www.flickr.com/photos/alan_s/http://loraltravel.blogspot.com > Latest: On Indian Roads- They won't be late because people who take the Palace on Wheels tour are deadly afraid of being left behind with the natives. They'll stick to their tour guide like glue. >> <po.n...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> I am looking for any input on the Palace on wheels in India. [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > are deadly afraid of being left behind with the natives. They'll > stick to their tour guide like glue. ROFL Jan > Far better off hiring a car and driver. Cheaper, more > flexible, able to see more, and he won't leave without you > if you're late getting back from sight-seeing. Seconded.  SignatureWilliam Black I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach Time for tea. >> Far better off hiring a car and driver. Cheaper, more >> flexible, able to see more, and he won't leave without you >> if you're late getting back from sight-seeing. > > Seconded. There was an ad this week in one of the UK's Saturday papers: 15 day PoW tour - £3,600 pp. I'm just in the process of planning a 35-day trip for this coming January/February and so far it's coming in at about £1,300 with everything included: flights ex-UK, India Rail Pass, 22 nights' 3-star hotel accommodation, 3 nights' tiger safari, all food, spending money and visa. Must say that the PoW "experience" looks very impressive - but Christ, what a blinkin' rip off! Gerry > >> Far better off hiring a car and driver. Cheaper, more > >> flexible, able to see more, and he won't leave without you [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Gerry Dear Gerry , We are the travel agent based at New Delhi ,India. we can make all your arrangements at cheaper prices if you give us a chance . Please email us with your all details that what all places you want to cover. EMAIL : flyindiatravel@gmail.com or info@flyindiatour.com +91-9215585094 >>> Far better off hiring a car and driver. Cheaper, more >>> flexible, able to see more, and he won't leave without you [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Must say that the PoW "experience" looks very impressive - but Christ, > what a blinkin' rip off! Once you get to India things get cheap. SignatureWilliam Black I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach Time for tea. >>>> Far better off hiring a car and driver. Cheaper, more >>>> flexible, able to see more, and he won't leave without you [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >> There was an ad this week in one of the UK's Saturday papers: 15 >> day PoW tour - £3,600 pp. Only 7 days on PoW though ! Other nights in hotels with breakfast each day. Includes a total of 5 lunches, 4 dinners, excusions and flights from UK. Now that is overly expensive Jan >> I'm just in the process of planning a 35-day trip for this coming >> January/February and so far it's coming in at about £1,300 with [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Once you get to India things get cheap. > >> Far better off hiring a car and driver. Cheaper, more > >> flexible, able to see more, and he won't leave without you [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Gerry And that's double occupancy. It's not a rip off, but they offer a service that some people are willing to pay for. E.g. insulation from the locals. On Jul 7, 9:25 am, "Gerald Oliver Swift" <gosw...@hotmail.com> wrote: > Must say that the PoW "experience" looks very impressive - but Christ, > what > a blinkin' rip off! > > Gerry And that's double occupancy. It's not a rip off, but they offer a service that some people are willing to pay for. E.g. insulation from the locals. ------------------------- Why would people want to be insulated from the locals? India can be difficult, but I find the place endlessly entertaining. SignatureWilliam Black I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach Time for tea. On Jul 8, 5:40 am, "William Black" <william.bl...@hotmail.co.uk> wrote: > On Jul 7, 9:25 am, "Gerald Oliver Swift" <gosw...@hotmail.com> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > India can be difficult, but I find the place endlessly entertaining. There are lots of different reasons and ways people want to travel. You like it one way, don't mean everyone has to think the same. > -- > William Black [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach > Time for tea. > On Jul 8, 5:40 am, "William Black" <william.bl...@hotmail.co.uk> > wrote: [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] > > - Show quoted text - Actually this POW is cultural train which is picturescue of Rajasthani culture and how The Mughal Kings lived in Past and make you feel like emperor in a palace. Thanx Deepak Actually this POW is cultural train which is picturescue of Rajasthani culture and how The Mughal Kings lived in Past and make you feel like emperor in a palace. ------------------------------ I didn't think the Mughal Kings built many railways in India... Zafar was exiled only four years after the first passenger train ran, and that ran from Bombay to Thane, inside the 'Bombay Presidency'. SignatureWilliam Black I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach Time for tea. > Actually this POW is cultural train which is picturescue of Rajasthani > culture and how The Mughal Kings lived in Past and make you feel like [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Zafar was exiled only four years after the first passenger train ran, and > that ran from Bombay to Thane, inside the 'Bombay Presidency'. Surely you're not suggesting that "heritage travel" in India has elements of fictional reconstruction? Cheers, George W Russell Bangalore >> Actually this POW is cultural train which is picturescue of Rajasthani >> culture and how The Mughal Kings lived in Past and make you feel like [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > Surely you're not suggesting that "heritage travel" in India has elements > of fictional reconstruction? Just about everything involving 'high quality tourism' in India is fiction. India has become adept at selling a view of itself where the British have become totally irrelevant. The only place I've even seen the Raj mentioned was at Sabarmati Ashram, where they're depicted as stupid, stubborn and wicked. India has created a false legend out of history, and is busy trying to make people believe it. SignatureWilliam Black I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach Time for tea. >>> Actually this POW is cultural train which is picturescue of Rajasthani >>> culture and how The Mughal Kings lived in Past and make you feel like [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] >India has created a false legend out of history, and is busy trying to make >people believe it. Agreed; however there were several plaques and other mementoes at the Red Fort (Agra) and the Taj Mahal dedicated to past British governors or those who saved the Taj from destruction. Cheers, Alan, Australia -- http://www.flickr.com/photos/alan_s/ http://loraltravel.blogspot.com Latest: On Indian Roads >>>> Actually this POW is cultural train which is picturescue of Rajasthani >>>> culture and how The Mughal Kings lived in Past and make you feel like [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > to past British governors or those who saved the Taj from > destruction. Bangalore is relatively kind to the British too, despite the recent nonsense over renaming (what is nationalism called if it's at a state level?). Many of the Indian names for suburbs are totally ignored. Nobody refers to the suburb I live in, Richmond Town, as Sir Mirza Ismail Nagar, its official name. Sir Mark Cubbon, the former commissioner of Mysore who died in 1861, is commemorated for having established Bangalore's parks, a mainstay of the city's relative liveability. A large statue of Queen Victoria sits unmolested in Cubbon Park. Far more strangely, there's a statue of King Edward VII in one corner and young women occasionally furtively pray in front of it. (A local scholar thinks it might be related to fertility). (And yes, the irony of including the British knighthood in the eponym escaped the authorities). Residency Road (Cariappa Road) and Richmond Road (Thimmiah Road) have both retained their colonial names to anyone who matters, even if you're using them in a Kannada sentence. Rickshaw drivers would be confounded if you used the new names. Cheers, George W Russell Bangalore > (And yes, the irony of including the British knighthood in the eponym > escaped the authorities). I might be an Indian order. They remain in the gift of the Indian government, although they haven't awarded any since independence... I wonder if they know... SignatureWilliam Black I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach Time for tea. >> (And yes, the irony of including the British knighthood in the eponym >> escaped the authorities). [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > I wonder if they know... I didn't know such things existed, but Ismail, then diwan of Mysore, was knighted (KCSI) by the British in 1930. He also held an OBE. He's famous or notorious, depending on your perspective, for opposing the integration of Hyderabad with India when he was diwan of Hyderabad in the 1940s. Cheers, George W Russell Bangalore >>> (And yes, the irony of including the British knighthood in the eponym >>> escaped the authorities). [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > I didn't know such things existed, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_the_Star_of_India http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_the_Indian_Empire SignatureWilliam Black I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach Time for tea. >>>> (And yes, the irony of including the British knighthood in the eponym >>>> escaped the authorities). [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_the_Indian_Empire Oh, I know about those two. Ismail got a KCSI from the British. Cheers, George W Russell Bangalore >>>> Actually this POW is cultural train which is picturescue of Rajasthani >>>> culture and how The Mughal Kings lived in Past and make you feel like [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > to past British governors or those who saved the Taj from > destruction. In Bombay the Hindu nationalists are busy erasing the British from history, but everyone just ignores them. Everyone uses the old names When Congress gets power they say, with perfect justification, that they've better things to do with their time than go around having debates on what to call a street that has a perfectly serviceable name already... One problem is that places that have strong British associations and ARE historically significant, such as Mahim Fort, are being encroached upon by squatters and nobody does anything because they'd like it to just disappear... SignatureWilliam Black I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach Time for tea. "William Black" <william.black@hotmail.co.uk> kirjoitti viestissä:g54trq$uh$1@registered.motzarella.org... > In Bombay the Hindu nationalists are busy erasing the British from > history, The city is called Mumbai today. > "William Black" <william.black@hotmail.co.uk> kirjoitti > viestissä:g54trq$uh$1@registered.motzarella.org... >> >> In Bombay the Hindu nationalists are busy erasing the British from >> history, > The city is called Mumbai today. Not by the people who live there. SignatureWilliam Black I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach Time for tea. >> "William Black" <william.black@hotmail.co.uk> kirjoitti >> viestissä:g54trq$uh$1@registered.motzarella.org... [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Not by the people who live there. Chennai managed to entrench itself. Kolkata too, maybe. Not the others. There was an ill-fated attempt a few years ago to rename Delhi as Dilli. Cheers, George W Russell Bangalore >>> "William Black" <william.black@hotmail.co.uk> kirjoitti >>> viestissä:g54trq$uh$1@registered.motzarella.org... [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Chennai managed to entrench itself. Kolkata too, maybe. Not the others. > There was an ill-fated attempt a few years ago to rename Delhi as Dilli. My experience is that the penny dropped when people from the UK started looking blank when the new names were mentioned and Indian businessmen started getting twitchy about inwards investment to what was looking more and more as a hotbed of loony Hindu nationalism. SignatureWilliam Black I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach Time for tea. >>>> "William Black" <william.black@hotmail.co.uk> kirjoitti >>>> viestissä:g54trq$uh$1@registered.motzarella.org... [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > started getting twitchy about inwards investment to what was looking more > and more as a hotbed of loony Hindu nationalism. And in Bombay/Mumbai's case, not merely loony rightwing Hindu nationalism, but loony right-wing Marathi provincialism It appears to me that in any kind of business or professional milieu in Bombay, the name I choose to use first in a sentence will be the opposite of what everyone else in the room calls it in later references. Cheers, George W Russell Bangalore >>>>> "William Black" <william.black@hotmail.co.uk> kirjoitti >>>>> viestissä:g54trq$uh$1@registered.motzarella.org... [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > And in Bombay/Mumbai's case, not merely loony rightwing Hindu nationalism, > but loony right-wing Marathi provincialism I noticed, they passed a law just before I returned to the UK this year saying all the legal documents and court cases and business licenses have to be in Marathi. That should kill off employment for a few tens of thousands... > It appears to me that in any kind of business or professional milieu in > Bombay, the name I choose to use first in a sentence will be the opposite > of what everyone else in the room calls it in later references. If there's anyone official about everyone calls it 'Mumbai' because the poor babus can get the sack for not doing so. I find that calling the place by the area name (Fort, Breach Candy, Bandra and etc) works until you know who is about... Everyone local can usually spot a Shiv Sanic <sp> it fifty paces without any problem... SignatureWilliam Black I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach Time for tea. >>>>>> "William Black" <william.black@hotmail.co.uk> kirjoitti >>>>>> viestissä:g54trq$uh$1@registered.motzarella.org... [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] > Everyone local can usually spot a Shiv Sanic <sp> it fifty paces without > any problem... Sainik. It means soldier. I keep hearing a sort of "Pompey" pronunciation that could pass for either. Maybe it's my ears. Cheers, George W Russell Bangalore "grusl" <grusl@hotma_nospam_il.usual> kirjoitti viestissä:g55nbh$kmh$1@registered.motzarella.org... > I keep hearing a sort of "Pompey" pronunciation that could pass for > either. Maybe it's my ears. A bit like Pompeii? >> I find that calling the place by the area name (Fort, Breach Candy, >> Bandra and etc) works until you know who is about... [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Sainik. It means soldier. And right nasty bastards they are too... > I keep hearing a sort of "Pompey" pronunciation that could pass for > either. Maybe it's my ears. I think it depends on the native language of the speaker. Indians who speak English as a first language tend to pronounce the 'B' at the front, as do people from the northern states, but the various other languages tend to pronounce it slightly differently. Anyone who says 'Mumbai' distinctly is making a political point... SignatureWilliam Black I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach Time for tea. "William Black" <william.black@hotmail.co.uk> kirjoitti viestissä:g565kt$nii$1@registered.motzarella.org... > Anyone who says 'Mumbai' distinctly is making a political point... The word seems to be in common use by both Indians and non-Indians. The city can be called Mumbai without any cunning demonstrative tone. > "William Black" <william.black@hotmail.co.uk> kirjoitti > viestissä:g565kt$nii$1@registered.motzarella.org... [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > The word seems to be in common use by both Indians and non-Indians. The > city can be called Mumbai without any cunning demonstrative tone. We've just had a longish conversation about that. Try reading back along the thread. The two people with actual real life experience of this say that it can be a problem. SignatureWilliam Black I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach Time for tea. >> "William Black" <william.black@hotmail.co.uk> kirjoitti >> viestissä:g565kt$nii$1@registered.motzarella.org... [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > The two people with actual real life experience of this say that it can be > a problem. I would agree that most non-Indians would use either name without any political motive. As a rule, younger people would say Mumbai, just like they would say Beijing instead of Peking. (However, the use of Peking by foreigners is usually calculated). I was surprised to see Canton (instead of Guangzhou) in The New Yorker the other week, although that magazine does spell both cooperate and reelect with an umlaut. Cheers, George W Russell Bangalore > "William Black" <william.black@hotmail.co.uk> kirjoitti > viestissä:g565kt$nii$1@registered.motzarella.org... [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > The word seems to be in common use by both Indians and non-Indians. The > city can be called Mumbai without any cunning demonstrative tone. Before the political drama, it used to be called - Bombay in English - Mumbai in Marathi & - Bambai in Hindi > Sainik. It means soldier. > > I keep hearing a sort of "Pompey" pronunciation that could pass for > either. Maybe it's my ears. You are probably referring to "Bambai". Mumbadevi is the original temple of the goddess in Bombay from which the name Mumbai was derived. Bambai is how Bombay it is referred to in Hindi, just like Delhi is Dilli. Bambaiyya - native of Bambai. Mumbai is how it is referred to in Marathi. Mumbaikar - native of Mumbai. For me, it's always Bombay. >> Sainik. It means soldier. >> >> I keep hearing a sort of "Pompey" pronunciation that could pass for >> either. Maybe it's my ears. > > You are probably referring to "Bambai". Thanks but, no, I'm not. I'm referring to when people try to say both names at the same time so as not to offend anyone. It's all politically dressed-up Portuguese, anyway. Cheers, George W Russell Bangalore > Cheers, Alan, Australia > -- > http://www.flickr.com/photos/alan_s/ > http://loraltravel.blogspot.com > Latest: On Indian Roads Alan, The information about indian cases on your travelouge isn't correct. From the site >>There seems to be one major manufacturer of cars in >>India - Tata. For about half a century one car was the >> flagship of the fleet, the Ambassador. Tata Motors got into car manufacturing very recently - the late 90's. Till then they were mainly manufacturing trucks. The Ambassador is manufactured by Hindustan Motors. Ambassador(by HM) & the Padmini(manufactured by Premier Motos) used to be the only 2 cars you could see in India earlier. In the 80's, Maruti Suzuki, a joint venture between the Indian Govt & Suzuki came in & turned the market on it's head. Maruti is still #1 in the local car market. Tata Motors is probably #2. Hyundai may be #3. Rest of the market is Honda, Toyota, Chevy, Ford, Hindustan Motors, Mahindra etc. Also Mercedes, BMW, Volvo, Nissan etc. Tata Motors got into the car market mainly in the late 90's with the Indica which is very popular Hindustan Motors still sells around 50-60 thousand new Ambassadors every year which still looks the same from outside. They also manufacture & sell the Mitsubishi Lancer/Cedia etc. Premier doesn't sell cars anymore. >> Cheers, Alan, Australia >> -- [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > > Hindustan Motors still sells around 50-60 thousand Sorry that should 5-10 thousand. > new Ambassadors every year which still looks the > same from outside. They also manufacture & sell > the Mitsubishi Lancer/Cedia etc. > > Premier doesn't sell cars anymore. >> Cheers, Alan, Australia >> -- [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] > >Premier doesn't sell cars anymore. Thanks for the correction and clarification. I was obviously mis-informed:-) Cheers, Alan, Australia -- http://www.flickr.com/photos/alan_s/ http://loraltravel.blogspot.com Latest: On Indian Roads >>> Cheers, Alan, Australia >>> -- [quoted text clipped - 37 lines] > Thanks for the correction and clarification. I was obviously > mis-informed:-) The Ambassadors are almost all bought by the government and used as official cars. Which somehow seems a cruel and unusual punishment for honesty, the crooked officials usually dump them and buy Toyota Land Cruisers... SignatureWilliam Black I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach Time for tea. >> Actually this POW is cultural train which is picturescue of Rajasthani >> culture and how The Mughal Kings lived in Past and make you feel like [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >Surely you're not suggesting that "heritage travel" in India has elements of >fictional reconstruction? Heaven forbid! Surely not! Cheers, Alan, Australia -- http://www.flickr.com/photos/alan_s/ http://loraltravel.blogspot.com Latest: On Indian Roads |
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